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+--- Thread: Cloth Mesh disappearing when pressing play (/thread-2721.html)
Cloth Mesh disappearing when pressing play - Merch137 - 25-01-2021
Just did the setup exactly like the video to test my first cloth and I'm having this happen and not sure why.
Before playmode
![[Image: YA3rNR.jpg]](https://i.snipboard.io/YA3rNR.jpg)
After playmode
![[Image: 5WeBbK.jpg]](https://i.snipboard.io/5WeBbK.jpg)
RE: Cloth Mesh disappearing when pressing play - josemendez - 25-01-2021
(25-01-2021, 08:14 PM)Merch137 Wrote: Just did the setup exactly like the video to test my first cloth and I'm having this happen and not sure why.
Before playmode
After playmode
I’m unable to reproduce this. How have you set up the blueprint? What mesh did you use to generate it?
RE: Cloth Mesh disappearing when pressing play - Merch137 - 25-01-2021
(25-01-2021, 09:20 PM)josemendez Wrote: I’m unable to reproduce this. How have you set up the blueprint? What mesh did you use to generate it?
Is the mesh you used double sided faces or an object like this one that's really thin?
![[Image: sCFtZ8.jpg]](https://i.snipboard.io/sCFtZ8.jpg)
Blueprint was setup like yours was just pressed generate and tested out for a first test.
Mesh on the left is the same one as on the right.
These are heavily decimated for an rts. If you have a link to tips on how the mesh is required to be made I'd like to read it. The CA in the name stands for cavalry armor.
![[Image: NhZmzA.jpg]](https://i.snipboard.io/NhZmzA.jpg)
RE: Cloth Mesh disappearing when pressing play - Merch137 - 26-01-2021
(25-01-2021, 09:20 PM)josemendez Wrote: I’m unable to reproduce this. How have you set up the blueprint? What mesh did you use to generate it?
Just incase you have doubts on screenshots.
So, if the videos quality changes there and not here I'll come re-post it in an edit. Decided to upload here as youtube has my videos all messed up/not there/accounts being altered where when I login the account has changed from their so called updates and have no access to videos/account where I exposed cheaters in guildwars which is being silenced by force there on twitch and many other places, and I probably won't use it anymore.
What I have setup here is a simple arm movement one side to see the cloth moving with the arm, and the other side staying still to see the cloths resting position.
RE: Cloth Mesh disappearing when pressing play - josemendez - 26-01-2021
There's several things that look off in the video.
- Some transforms in your character hierarchy have non-unit scale. There's one with 100, another with 200-ish. While it's not necessary to use unity-scaling for cloth, you need to compensate for it when building the blueprint, and this is often not easy for beginners as you need to use the inverse scale and understand transform hierarchies quite well.
By far the simplest solution is to always use unit scale on your transforms. This can easily be achieved by applying the transform values to your vertices before exporting. In Blender, Object->Apply->Scale, in Maya Edit->Freeze Transforms, etc.
The reason for using unit scaling is that cloth blueprints take a mesh as input, but a mesh may be transformed by many different transforms once drawn on scene. In your case, you're rendering the mesh 100 times bigger than it really is, but the cloth has been generated for the unscaled mesh. So you're simulating the cloth at unit scale, but drawing it 100 times larger. Scaling (and transforms in general) do not work as you'd expect for deformable objects since these are affine transforms, and can only transform rigid objects. At best, this will result in your mesh being invisible, at worst it will become a triangle soup.
Sorry if this is a lot of information condensed into a few lines. Takeaway is to always have clean transform hierarchies, and to always use real-world units when dealing with any kind of physics (your guys should be roughly 1.8 units tall).
- I see the bottom part of the character's cloth normals look bent. My guess is that this is because you're using two-sided flat meshes, which are non-manifold. You can model meshes any way you want, but the only restriction Obi puts on cloth meshes is that they must be 2-manifold. Otherwise, they won't be simulated.
This is warned about in the manual:
http://obi.virtualmethodstudio.com/tutorials/clothsetup.html
If you're unsure what non-manifold meshes are, there's tons of resources online describing it and explaining how to avoid/fix non-manifoldness. Roughly speaking, a non-manifold mesh defines a surface that cannot exist in the real world. A 2-manifold mesh, is a mesh that can be unfolded into a flat surface. This means all edges can belong to 1 or 2 faces, not more. No floating vertices, no zero-length edges, no zero-area faces, no adjacent faces with opposite normal direction, etc. This is the same restriction that 3D printers impose on meshes (as it's impossible to get a non-manifold mesh into the real world).
In the particular case of two-sided meshes, they're non-manifold because edges are connected to 4 faces at once (2 faces per side). The usual approach to flat two-sided meshes is not to duplicate and flip faces, but to just use a two-sided shader. It's cheaper, looks much better, and can actually be simulated.
- Finally, a personal observation: if you're aiming to add cloth simulation to a RTS, keep in mind that cloth simulation is expensive. Unless you have a really clear idea of what your ms/frame budget is and how much you want to spend on each specific thing (AI, pathfinding, rendering, etc), better add cloth simulation once you have all basic systems in place and you know for a fact how much extra time you can spend on eye candy.
Let me know if you need any help with this. Cheers!
RE: Cloth Mesh disappearing when pressing play - Merch137 - 26-01-2021
(26-01-2021, 08:51 AM)josemendez Wrote: There's several things that look off in the video.
- Some transforms in your character hierarchy have non-unit scale. There's one with 100, another with 200-ish. While it's not necessary to use unity-scaling for cloth, you need to compensate for it when building the blueprint, and this is often not easy for a beginner as you need to use the inverse scale and understand transform hierarchies quite well.
I almost want to stop you here and not even read the rest of your post and request a refund for your item.
I know the scale is off it starts off at scale 1,1,1 however my character in this scene was already at 100 and I figured since the scale of the item is normall at 100 with the character, I would make the blueprint at 100 to match otherwise when it goes down to 1, 1,1 this might be causing it to not be visible as it has shrunk and now deoesnt match if you would like to give me a refund for this product I will take it I no longer want your support.
It appears to be trying to avoid people being smarter than others with derogatorily calling someone a beginner at something.
Also, I have rescaled these things, and not sure why they are at 100 in this scene as its probably been about a year since Ive last rescaled them due to having a severe problem I need to deal with where I have to question any comment like you just made as being derogatory and openly defamatory for the losers/cheaters paying anyone i come into contact with to defame me to make me look like an inferior mind even if its very subtle like that right there it would deserve consequences for the action of helping ruin the image of the mind for someone to alter truth and those consequences never come so everyone is used to abusing me into a slander that is being forced for idiots to avoid the truth.
It has been rescaled in different ways the model is originally a zbrush item, that then got decimated, and zbrush is pretty much kind of a joke in scaling although it can scale, and in the rts if I were the make this unit 1.8 meters im fairly scertain my map would have to be larger instead of making everything really tiny, in which case that larger terrain takes fps from hundreds to teens. So theres many things to consider, however I still have not read your post being extremely offended.
-------------------------------------------------
I shrunk everything down to 1,1,1 and went into scene view since it could not be seen and while having the character above the ground i seen the cloth inbetween his legs, however the character jumped up in size as the rig jumped back up to 200,200,200 in scale and the cloth was jumbled between his legs, so while you might be right on scale being the issue the way you come across is very typical defamatory.
It looks like the cloth worked and fell to the ground not catching on to something so large or something after transforms got changed upon pressing play and it was still small, however when everything is all in scale this should not be happening and im going to raise the character up and take a look at him with what happens when its all scaled how it was.
![[Image: S8geGK.jpg]](https://i.snipboard.io/S8geGK.jpg)
RE: Cloth Mesh disappearing when pressing play - josemendez - 26-01-2021
(26-01-2021, 12:28 PM)Merch137 Wrote: I almost want to stop you here and not even read the rest of your post and request a refund for your item [...] if you would like to give me a refund for this
It appears to be trying to avoid people being smarter than others with derogatorily calling someone a beginner at something.
Wow, just wow. I was just trying to help you by pointing out things that seemed off to me in the video. I also explained the reasons why they looked off, tried to give you solutions, and took the time to explain things in detail. It was never my intention to be offensive in any way.
If you think there's something degrading or derogatory in being a beginner at something, now that's a real problem. We've all been there, we are all still there in some sense. I'm a beginner too in most areas. Progress comes from acknowledging areas in which we are beginners, then working to improve.
(26-01-2021, 12:28 PM)Merch137 Wrote: I have to question any comment like you just made as being derogatory and openly defamatory for the losers/cheaters paying anyone i come into contact with to defame me to make me look like an inferior mind even if its very subtle like that right there it would deserve consequences for the action of helping ruin the image of the mind for someone to alter truth and those consequences never come so everyone is used to abusing me into a slander that is being forced for idiots to avoid the truth.
I don't think I said anything remotely defamatory, derogatory, or offensive in my previous post. If that's how you feel, then by all means I'll grant you a refund and we part ways here. I'm sorry I wasn't able to help you.
Let me know your invoice number so that I can request a refund to the Asset Store.
RE: Cloth Mesh disappearing when pressing play - Merch137 - 26-01-2021
(26-01-2021, 12:50 PM)josemendez Wrote: Wow, just wow. I was just trying to help you by pointing out things that seemed off to me in the video. I also explained the reasons why they looked off, tried to give you solutions, and took the time to explain things in detail. It was never my intention to be offensive in any way.
That can be done without making subtle yet defamatory comments.
Quote: and this is often not easy for beginners as you need to use the inverse scale and understand transform hierarchies quite well.
RE: Cloth Mesh disappearing when pressing play - josemendez - 26-01-2021
(26-01-2021, 01:02 PM)Merch137 Wrote: That can be done without making subtle yet defamatory comments.
Can you point me to one of these in my post? I honestly don't know what I said that was wrong.
RE: Cloth Mesh disappearing when pressing play - Merch137 - 26-01-2021
(26-01-2021, 01:07 PM)josemendez Wrote: Can you point me to one of these in my post? I honestly don't know what I said that was wrong.
Quote:and this is often not easy for beginners as you need to use the inverse scale and understand transform hierarchies quite well.
Scaling something is probably going to be the least of someones worries working alone and having to learn the entirety of game design and pretty much has already accomplished it by himself self learning from nothing... coding and 3d modelling. However knowing the basics of 3d from opening things like 3ds max since I was 12 helped when it came to making 3d and having to prove myself to people trying to make not wanting to learn 3d into incompetence. 3d printing modelling things to scale, transforms being the simplest and probably one of the first things you learn in unity when using it as a game engine before even learning how to code or 3d model. It was like making the simplest thing into something that is going to be hard to understand for an inferior mind.
and the cloth appears to be working itself. Scaling being the issue here when the bones jumped back up in size making it fall to the floor or something.